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Outlaw Gambler

Short two question poll regarding 1897 shotguns

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20 in with chokes.    Despite conventional thinking, (Usually with no tested and proven logic), chokes can make a difference.  Wide open chokes, (Cyl Bore), is not the best or most effective in shooting Cowboy.  Many Cowboys shoot open chokes and get away with it, but that's not the ideal way.

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If the wad of an open bore hits the KD at approx 10 yrs, did the shot have much of a dispersion at that distance and did a large amount of the shot also hit the KD?

If so, if most of the shot hit the KD, then why would anything more restrictive then an open bore be necessary?

 

I've witness many wads hitting the KD from open bore shotguns, including mine.  When that happens, it appears that nearly all of the shot also hit the KD.

SIDE NOTE:  I don't actually see the wad hit the KD.....but I do see it when it bounces back after hitting the KD.

 

..........Widder

 

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Everything works if you hit the target dead on ....  BUT ... The greater spread will make the difference many times when you weren't quite there ... You may wing it and get the hit instead of having to reload. Also ... at the ranges we shoot you will have a greater chance of winging that flying coke can we see every once and a while. IMHO anyhow ... -_-

 

Evidence ...

 

choke.jpg.f363256284e8041d8c9907663d7f9b5a.jpg

 

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Widder, as you are one of the premier shooters in this game, I won't argue with you on the subject of chokes.   All I will state is to put it on the pattern board.  I did, and found that Cyl choke no where near put all the shot on the target.  Skeet didn't either,   IC put over 75% of the shot in a 12 inch circle.  Remember, that's only 10 thousands of choke.   Not a huge amount of constriction, but it was capable of putting most of the shot load on the target.   I shoot 7/8 oz. shot loads, at about 1000 FPS or a little less, so I need to get most of my pattern on the target for best reliability.  It has worked flawlessly for me.  

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1 hour ago, Rio Brazos Kid said:

Widder, as you are one of the premier shooters in this game, I won't argue with you on the subject of chokes.   All I will state is to put it on the pattern board.  I did, and found that Cyl choke no where near put all the shot on the target.  Skeet didn't either,   IC put over 75% of the shot in a 12 inch circle.  Remember, that's only 10 thousands of choke.   Not a huge amount of constriction, but it was capable of putting most of the shot load on the target.   I shoot 7/8 oz. shot loads, at about 1000 FPS or a little less, so I need to get most of my pattern on the target for best reliability.  It has worked flawlessly for me.  

 

1 hour ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

If the wad of an open bore hits the KD at approx 10 yrs, did the shot have much of a dispersion at that distance and did a large amount of the shot also hit the KD?

If so, if most of the shot hit the KD, then why would anything more restrictive then an open bore be necessary?

 

I've witness many wads hitting the KD from open bore shotguns, including mine.  When that happens, it appears that nearly all of the shot also hit the KD.

SIDE NOTE:  I don't actually see the wad hit the KD.....but I do see it when it bounces back after hitting the KD.

 

..........Widder

 

 

 

If we do the math, cylinder bore shot will have an 8" wide spread at 5 yds and 16" spread at 10yds. Improved cylinder choke will have a 6.7" spread at 5yds and a 13.4" spread at 10yds. Thats according to the schematic Pete posted. Personally, Id rather have the larger diameter shot column at the expense of less energy at the kd. It shouldn't take many pellets to drop the kd if they're set correctly. Just my .02

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P.Pete,  Brazos Kid, TN.,

 

That is GOOD info, not only for me but for all the other readers.   Thank you kindly.

 

Kid, like you, I also use some 7/8 oz, 960 fps ammo (Win AA Featherlike) and you make a valid point.

 

TN,  It would be nice if ALL the KD's were correctly set and maintained their correct upright positions.  But as we know, and have witnessed, stuff happens.

Thats when I have to pull the trigger harder..... :lol:

See YOU at Black Gold on Thursday.

 

..........Widder

 

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18.5" with tubes.

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Side X Side no chokes. Since most stage designs today are run to a spot and shoot fast as you can a 97 has no advantages. When stage designs were fun and participants shot stages from under a old wagon and ect. the slide action had it's advantages. It's still nice to have a 97 for that rare stage. But if I could keep only one shootgun my original 97 Winchester would be the one to go. I have seen so many crazy things happen with a 97 that never happen with a side by side.

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