Author Topic: New WB shooter, lots of questions  (Read 559 times)

Boomstick Bruce

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New WB shooter, lots of questions
« on: November 24, 2018, 07:18:52 PM »
So, I have only shot one WB match. I used my 1953 '97, a RIA 1911 and my Rossi 92 45colt. I just picked up 3 model 12's and have been doing some reading and now I have questions. Two of the guns are vent ribbed barrels, one is smooth but all have Lyman cutts compensators. They are all factory installed. One is a 3" gun and I've been reading about the 3" gun not being usable for WB. I've never owned a model 12 before.

So question 1: are the vent rib guns even legal?
2: do I have to cut the compensators off?
3: is there a fix for the 3" gun?
Anything else about these guns I need to know?

Thanks!!!


Garrison Joe

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2018, 07:39:45 PM »
Factory vent ribs are allowed.

As I mentioned in Cowboy forum, no, I believe you don't have to remove a factory installed Cutts compensators/chokes, because factory configurations of many guns (such as the model 97 shotgun, or any of our rifles) are allowed.

3" chambered Model 12 guns can be used, they are legal.  Don't use 3" ammo, unneeded, slows you down, may compromise your ability to load 6 in mag tube, and may easily be "high velocity shells" (which are not allowed).   

You MUST get in the habit of every time you go to the loading table, to close the action and PULL THE TRIGGER before loading the magazine.  If you have not done this, when you attempt to rack the gun (with mag loaded, empty chamber, and internal hammer cocked), you will find you cannot get action slide to move, and the TO will call a Stage DQ for coming to the line with the hammer cocked.

Quote
From Page 21 of WB Shooters Handbook

From SDQ penalty list:
Loaded long guns not staged with the muzzle downrange, the action closed, the chamber empty, and the hammer either on the safety notch or fully down.

Good luck, GJ



« Last Edit: November 26, 2018, 09:08:54 PM by Garrison Joe »
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J. Frank Norfleet

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2018, 08:10:42 PM »
Try the 3" duck gun. Sometimes they work and sometimes they don't (my experience). Ribbed guns ok, I don't know about the Cuts compensator. Maybe HJ will chime in. Why leave them on. They don't work and add extra length. Most cut the shotgun barrels down to about 19" to 20" to make it easier to move with a shotgun. Multiple shotgun shooting positions is not unusual and it is easier if you are not hanging a long barrel on a prop.
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Garrison Joe

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2018, 09:36:21 PM »
Several shooters have fixed a feed problem in their long chamber guns, where the nose of the 2 3/4" shell falls off to the right of the chamber as the carrier rises, by putting the 2 3/4" carrier having shell stop blocks on it's top edge into their 3" chambered gun.  Prevents 3" shells from feeding, I would imagine.

Good luck, GJ

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Goatneck

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2018, 09:51:06 AM »
The Cutts by Lyman Comps on the model 12 are not legal in WB.  I have a 5 gallon bucket full of the compensators I have cut off M12 barrels when I do a custom action job on these shotguns.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 10:00:17 AM by Goatneck »

Happy Jack

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2018, 10:18:30 AM »
I agree with Goatneck. The Cutts comps are NOT LEGAL.  We have never spelled it out clearly in the rules but that has been the case since the beginning of sanctioned WBAS.  It was generally believed that the last bullet point under Shotgun barrels page 12.  Compensating ports are not allowed. Would make this clear enough. I will make a note for 2020 rule book as 2019 rule books are already posted.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 10:54:54 AM by Happy Jack »
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Boomstick Bruce

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2018, 10:47:13 AM »
Dang... I really didn't want to cut these up...

DUSTY BODDAMS

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2018, 11:29:05 AM »
BB, if those are marked with choke constriction on barrel then the chokes have been added. Shooting with these things on the end of the gun looks like a coffee can from shooters view. Collectibility is gone with all the scope mount holes anyway. Your gun and your choice but how many cutts compensated scoped model 12’s does a feller really need?  ;) You’re  in them at a smoking deal and they would be perfect for WB by just removing trinkets.    Dusty Boddams

lostvaquero

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2018, 01:33:34 PM »
Welcome to having a lot of fun.  Slowly getting better, did I say slow?

Boomstick Bruce

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2018, 03:10:59 PM »
how many cutts compensated scoped model 12’s does a feller really need?  ;)

All of them...lol...

What's the best way to cut the vent rib barrel? I cut a Mossberg years ago and discovered the last block held the rib on and it slid right off after I cut it. Ruined the barrel... I don't want to make the same mistake twice

DUSTY BODDAMS

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2018, 04:45:41 PM »
BB, maybe Goatneck will see this and chime in. I’ve cut several solid rib guns and no big deal. If you took the cutts off there would be a ring that could be cut off flush with the vent rib . However if your shortening the barrel I think talking to someone that’s cut several would be a good thing. It’s a lot easier to make it shorter than longer!🤠

Goatneck

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2018, 05:09:17 PM »
BB

If you are shortening a solid ribbed barrel you can cut it to your desired length with no problem.   If it's a vent rib than be Careful where you cut.
I would suggest making the cut right in front of one of the post.  You can get close to your desired length with this method.  Trim it back with a sharp fine tooth file than cold blue your cut.
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« Last Edit: November 26, 2018, 05:40:27 PM by Goatneck »

Boomstick Bruce

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2018, 08:59:38 PM »
So I finally have these guns in my hands. The one my step father is getting is ser#10002**... Less that 300 model 12's after the one millionth!!! Pretty cool if you ask me. That one is 1943, the other two are 1950 and 1957. The 43 and 50 are solid rib, the 57 is smooth. The 43 and 50 both have "full" stamped on the barrel, the 57 has "cyl"and a much shorter l.o.p... I'm assuming these compensators were all installed by a gunsmith. The 50 and 57 look brand new! The 43 not so much... Best part is, I'm only $170 bucks into the two of them!!! I really want to give one to Jordan, the kid I got into wild bunch, but I really want to keep them both, they are so pretty!!! Decisions, decisions...



Garrison Joe

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2018, 09:20:19 PM »
I'd agree you have non-factory Cutts compensators, since you found factory choke marks on all three barrels.  They really have no value to most folks - in fact a negative value.  Hope you have enough barrel length to be able to chop off the comps, because of the rule pointed out above by the principals in the rules committee, they would be illegal barrel compensation ports.

Make sure the folks you are going to gift the guns to really want a short-barrel with no choke.  It would be too late if they decided they wanted to take one duck or turkey hunting, after you had their gift shortened.    :'(

That short stock on the '57 would be a great youth shotgun for the sport.   (Make sure the transfer is to the parent, not a child under 18.)

Good luck, GJ

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Boomstick Bruce

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Re: New WB shooter, lots of questions
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2018, 04:55:59 AM »
Once I cut them off, the shortest barrel would still be over 22".. one other thing I think it's cool is all 3 still have the plug in then and they are all labeled with a Winchester sticker. My step father got the 43, and it's going to be left in the condition it's in including the plug. The other two are getting the comps cut off and the scopes taken off for WB. I think I'm going to sell my 97 now and put the money towards a back up double barrel. I've been planning on the 97 for WB and as a back up to my Stevens single trigger 315 but now that I have the model 12's I don't need the 97...

It's a good thing someone else ruined the collector value of these guns by adding the comps and drilling the frames because I would feel terrible cutting them up, especial with the condition they are in!