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Misty Moonshine

SASS- The Organization

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I really enjoy shooting in SASS matches. I have contributed to the Hall of Fame, Museum, Founders Ranch, etc. I have had a wonderful time competing in local, multi state and provincial matches, regional, WR, Canadian National and EOT events. Hopefully, I will be able participate in SASS until my demise.

 

The darkness overhanging SASS is not healthy. SASS' changing to non profit status is confusing. Who will be the directors and officers, what compensation, if any will they have, will it be a non stock and not-for-profit corporation, or will it have shareholders, how will the foregoing be selected, what is the current financial status of SASS, what is the current budget, what is the future budget, what assets will be in the new corporation, what will be excluded, et cetera?

 

IMHO, SASS membership includes quite a few sophisticated, younger individuals with management and financial expertise. I hope they will be tapped to ensure SASS will grow and continue to support our awesome shooting activities.

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Deleted.

Edited by Yul Lose

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I'm so thankful for SASS and the Wild Bunch. I've already paid to extend my life membership for a second lifetime. If they would find a founders club place for me I'd pay for that too.

 

Only the short sighted, uninformed, selfish fools can't see how vital SASS has been to the shooting world.

 

The only folks for which I feel some sentiment are those that truly are pinched by economics. But in all reality, at any level of cost, someone would be in financial stress. Where there is a will, you will find a way. The participation, experience, and relationships are priceless.

 

Additionally, before complaining about SASS membership, have you complained about the rise in prices of shotgun shells, reloading components, firearms, gun show tickets, boots, clothing, automobiles, trucks, tires, auto repairs, camping fees, gasoline, food, motel rooms, ice, cookies, candy bars, beer, booze and road tolls? Every one of those items have risen as great a percentage as your SASS membership which is still within the price of a good pair of shoes!

 

I say again. Thank you, thank you, thank you, to every Wild Bunch member living and dead. It's my belief that your efforts have not only been pioneering, but time will show them to be historically significant.

 

And, you fellers are lucky, I say LUCKY to have someone like Misty Moonshine to lead the fight, all the while, standing up to the headwinds of ignorance! She certainly has much more patience than I. To her credit, when she should be telling some of you peckerwoods where to get off, she spends hour upon hour patiently enlightening you as to how good you actually have it.

 

It's time for you cowards behind a keyboard to load up, dress up, and posse up to be part of the solution instead of just bellyachin'.

+1

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I'm so thankful for SASS and the Wild Bunch. I've already paid to extend my life membership for a second lifetime. If they would find a founders club place for me I'd pay for that too.

 

Only the short sighted, uninformed, selfish fools can't see how vital SASS has been to the shooting world.

 

The only folks for which I feel some sentiment are those that truly are pinched by economics. But in all reality, at any level of cost, someone would be in financial stress. Where there is a will, you will find a way. The participation, experience, and relationships are priceless.

 

Additionally, before complaining about SASS membership, have you complained about the rise in prices of shotgun shells, reloading components, firearms, gun show tickets, boots, clothing, automobiles, trucks, tires, auto repairs, camping fees, gasoline, food, motel rooms, ice, cookies, candy bars, beer, booze and road tolls? Every one of those items have risen as great a percentage as your SASS membership which is still within the price of a good pair of shoes!

 

I say again. Thank you, thank you, thank you, to every Wild Bunch member living and dead. It's my belief that your efforts have not only been pioneering, but time will show them to be historically significant.

 

And, you fellers are lucky, I say LUCKY to have someone like Misty Moonshine to lead the fight, all the while, standing up to the headwinds of ignorance! She certainly has much more patience than I. To her credit, when she should be telling some of you peckerwoods where to get off, she spends hour upon hour patiently enlightening you as to how good you actually have it.

 

It's time for you cowards behind a keyboard to load up, dress up, and posse up to be part of the solution instead of just bellyachin'.

+1 couldn't agree with you more. Don't know how I missed this. Probably because I get tired of the P&Ming and quit reading some of these topics. kR

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lots of in fighting here, regardless SASS is dying off, new members are few, especially in my area, more and more are letting there memberships expire since they don't shoot sass events. im the youngest sass member in my area(31) if we want sass to survive we need more members plain and simple. Will see what happens at the end of the year with SASS, I have a feeling they will have less $ then they did last year. Im proud to be a SASS member but we all are aware of the decline in numbers. We need to start reaching new blood, everyone I talk to knows about IPSC or 3 gun but when I mention SASS most draw a blank.

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I love SASS and this sport. I will support with paying my dues and other activities.

I do have a question and something that just kinds of well just stiffens my neck hair and little.

I always thought that you HAD TO be a SASS member to shoot at a SASS event. I was just told by one of the senior guys that many of the shooters or NOT SASS members!!! They do not shoot state or Regional matches. They only shoot at their local club. Can this be true? If yes should we consider local rule changes that would require ALL shooters to be SASS members after shooting for a two year adjustment period

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I love SASS and this sport. I will support with paying my dues and other activities.

I do have a question and something that just kinds of well just stiffens my neck hair and little.

I always thought that you HAD TO be a SASS member to shoot at a SASS event. I was just told by one of the senior guys that many of the shooters or NOT SASS members!!! They do not shoot state or Regional matches. They only shoot at their local club. Can this be true? If yes should we consider local rule changes that would require ALL shooters to be SASS members after shooting for a two year adjustment period

It is true.

 

I think SASS would alienate more people and clubs by requiring SASS membership to shoot at a SASS-affiliated club.

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We have had potential new shooters. We lend them some firearms, leather and ammo. After a few months they acquire all of their own firearms, leather, etc and join SASS.

 

This is called Marketing !

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I love SASS and this sport. I will support with paying my dues and other activities.

I do have a question and something that just kinds of well just stiffens my neck hair and little.

I always thought that you HAD TO be a SASS member to shoot at a SASS event. I was just told by one of the senior guys that many of the shooters or NOT SASS members!!! They do not shoot state or Regional matches. They only shoot at their local club. Can this be true? If yes should we consider local rule changes that would require ALL shooters to be SASS members after shooting for a two year adjustment period

IMHO, requiring SASS membership to shoot a local match would be the death of many small clubs. For whatever reason, and they've been beat to death on the wire, some folks will not join SASS. Quite a number of the pards that I shoot with have no interest in shooting a match above a local and there is nothing wrong with that. Edited by Yul Lose
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We have had potential new shooters. We lend them some firearms, leather and ammo. After a few months they acquire all of their own firearms, leather, etc and join SASS.

 

This is called Marketing !

This is exactly how my oldest brother, Bluewater Ringer, got me into BPCR and SASS. Not sure if he wants me to have fun or go broke.

 

But for now, I'm having fun but due to still being working age, don't get to have as much fun with either as I would like.

Edited by Lost Trail

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In my experience, the people who complain the most about SASS are the ones who rarely, if ever, venture outside of their local area or shoot outside of one or two local clubs. All it takes is a few trips to some larger matches outside of their local area to begin to see the benefits of having a Sanctioning organization for our sport, and SASS is that organization. I am fortunate that within an hours drive, I have 5 clubs at which I could shoot, one of which hosts the Maryland State Championship and one of which hosts the Eastern Divisional (formerly the NE Regional). In addition, I had the good fortune to be introduced to the game and trained by one of the best, Chuckaroo, who also is the Match Director for those two events. (Nothing he could do about my shootin' though, and he did try... :P ) Even when I traveled to matches held in adjacent states, they were still within the sphere of influence of Chuckaroo, so when I arrived at those, it was not surprising that it still had that familiar feel of home.

 

I didn't truly appreciate what SASS did for us all until I started to travel to matches far outside of my local area. My first "Away" match was a trip to Last Stand in Florida in 2007. A 1,000 mile drive, each way, with my wife and kids, so we could shoot a match in Florida in the Winter. I had it on good authority that it was a great match, but I was still a little anxious, but that quickly abated after I arrived. Although the stage designs were unlike anything I had ever experienced, and the props and stage decorations were completely over the top, and the competition was incredible ( it made me look like I was standing still ), my family and I FIT RIGHT IN! Why, because SASS RULES APPLIED! Even though it was like nothing I had ever seen before, it still felt like home.

 

Since then, my wife and I have returned to Florida for their State Match every year (except 2015 when the 2014 Convention was rescheduled to the same date) and last year we started also heading down for their State (now Territorial) BP Championship. Next year, we are adding the Ides Of March match in Florida to our schedule as well. I have made it my goal to try at least one new away match every year and this year, in June, my wife and I will be attending EOT for the first time. I no doubt will run into a few old friends there, probably meet a few Wire Pards, undoubtedly I will make some new friends there, and who knows, I may even get another hug from Allie Mo! But more than anything, I have no doubt that I will again feel right at home.

 

That is what SASS does for us. It gives us a common framework by which we know we can go ANYWHERE and play this game and be assured that we will be in a safe environment, where we will be greeted like long lost friends, where we will know and understand the rules, and where we KNOW we will have a great time. Shooting at your local club is great, and I still do that as often as possible, but my recommendation is to get out there and travel, even just to a neighboring State Championship, and I believe you will quickly begin to get an appreciation for what SASS does for us all and why it is important.

 

And as far as the loss of members, I suspect that while individual club attendance might be down, the number of clubs is up. No one can shoot them all, so people are getting more particular about when and where they go. Some folks get out of the sport due to health or financial reasons, some get tired of club politics, some are just going through a hectic period in their lives with kids or school or jobs, and some just decide to play golf (although, I have no idea why! :D), but we are still seeing new members all the time. The Cowboy Clinics, hosted by Chuckaroo at my home club are always full, and there is always interest by Non-Cowboys at our club who want to join in on the fun. Heck, I even got my Daughter-In-Law and two Grand-Kids SASS memberships for Christmas. Although it will be a few years before the Grand-Kids (5 & 1 1/2) are old enough to shoot, they already know that Grammy and PaPa play Cowboy on the weekends and they know it's fun.

 

So, get out there, travel around a bit, and introduce someone new to the sport. All it took for me, was to see a couple of matches, take the clinic, and get my wife out to see an annual match. I hooked us up with a posse that had three women shooters, and they took my wife under their wing and before we left for the day, she was already talking about costumes, guns we NEEDED TO BUY, etc. There is an old saying that I have found to be true in many aspects of life....."It Has To Get Worse, Before It Can Get Better". I have complete faith that SASS will make it through this "Worse" period and come out the other side stronger, "Better", and ready for the challenges that lie ahead.

 

See you all down the Trail....

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I agree with Dogmeat Dad. Getting out to various areas to shoot with different SASS/CAS clubs is a great time, opportunity to meet new folks and experience different styles of CAS.

 

When we lived in Colorado, I shot with two different clubs; one shot the current SASS style with large, close target. The other shoots 'old school' with small targets easily twice the distance maybe even 3 times for the rifle.

 

I have also traveled to Idaho and several matches with multiple clubs in AZ hanging out with my brother. All these have provided great opportunity to meet some VERY good shooters, watch, learn, laugh, get humbled, joke, see things and people to avoid.

 

I'm trying to get to a point of shooting matches here in IL, but so far my work schedule (we own our business, so...) has not allowed for me to get out to any matches yet. Hopefully April 16 will change that.

 

Overall, IMHO, SASS does more right than wrong. I'm sometimes frustrated by the lack of response to questions posed or emails sent, I think the lack of SASS would be a great loss to the continuity of the sport.

Edited by Lost Trail

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I am a relatively new member...joined in 2015...and have only been shooting CAS style since 2014. I have also been on the boards of numerous non-profits and have been a small business owner for 35 years. Guys......it costs much more to run a business than the average Joe even remotely understands. Given the expenses involved in the "real world" for any consumer item, the annual dues we pay for our SASS memberships is almost nothing. Due to the huge increase in expenses involved in recent government regulation in my business, we (and all those in my niche) had to dramatically increase our fees effective January 1, 2016...by 35%, and that just about breaks us even after taking into consideration the additional costs to do business. I understand that some folks are economically and financially strapped for many reasons., but given what is provided to us for a minimal fee (almost nothing in the big picture), there is nothing to realistic complain about. My personal experience with SASS has been WONDERFUL. Misty is always watching the WIRE and being helpful. Sure....sometimes things might not happen immediately, but there is always a satisfactory outcome. This is supposed to be FUN, so keep it FUN. If you are not having fun, you are missing the "spirit of the game." I also agree with one of my pards in this thread who did not like the name calling. However, I agree... quit whining. The SASS membership dues are more than reasonable. Posse up and have some FUN. My club in Wartrace, TN has been nothing but fun....could be the most fun hobby I ever had.....terribly frustrating at times....but when all your equipment is running right and you are relaxed, it is great fun. All of the Wartrace Regulators are helpful and friendly and will do anything to make your match fun and rewarding. My profession is in the law (real estate and probate, so I am one of the good guys), so I am by nature very suspicious and guarded, but I have NEVER done business or had any dealings with a single cowboy who was not honest and respectful. Most will even ship things you buy on the WIRE CLASSIFIEDS before every receiving their money. How unworldly is that? Wake up guys!! This organization is the best. Support it. That is all I have to say about that.

Edited by Hopalong Mac McLin

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OK just renewed my membership and sent in my EOT entry form and here is what the raise in membership cost me NO WARM UP AT EOT. AND WIFE SAID IF IT GOES UP ANYMORE NO MORE SASS !

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It is true.

 

I think SASS would alienate more people and clubs by requiring SASS membership to shoot at a SASS-affiliated club.

You didn't see the letter from SASS where they are now asking clubs to pay SASS for non members that shoot at their local matches.

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You didn't see the letter from SASS where they are now asking clubs to pay SASS for non members that shoot at their local matches.

Little Rob,

 

I haven't seen a letter from SASS where we are asking clubs to pay SASS for non members that shoot at local matches.... I'd sure like to see what you are referring to.

 

Misty

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Misty;

 

My recollection is there was some fee associated with non-SASS members as part of a Club's membership. My recollection is all of our Club's membership were polled to verify whether all were SASS members in good standing. If my recollection is correct, then this may be what Little Rob is addressing.

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Misty...I think they're talking about the annual SASS Club affiliation fee:

If 100 percent are SASS members in the club, then the club pays no SASS affiliation fee.

If 25 percent of the club members are not SASS members, the club must pay $75 to SASS.

If 50 percent of club members are not SASS members, the club must pay $100.

 

I'm guessing that "the letter" mentioned above, is the one sent out by Roxy West last August which came with the new SASS club affiliation application form.

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I've been shootin' with SASS for the past 3 years and it has been a great family activity. We will be upgrading our memberships in the future. SASS provides the most kicks per dollar spent of any activity I've participated in. Let's keep shootin', quit whining, and do whatever needs doing.

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Well said. I'll be upgrading to life member next renewal.

 

Count me in. After what I saw last week, I see no reason not to.

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I'm wanting to upgrade to a Life Membership also, but now with another impending move on the horizon, going to have to throttle back on some of the 'want to'.

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:FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm::FlagAm: :FlagAm:

 

Thanky, Misty!!!

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I've been shooting a few years. A lot less than I would like mainly due to wrong priorities (putting work ahead of shooting). That will change soon. Out of all the shooting disciplines I have been in this is absolutely the most fun, mainly because of the people. I keep up on the "WIRE" somewhat but have never posted.

Thank you Misty for all you do.

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3 out of 4 clubs in my area have dropped there sass affiliation since sass would not explain to the clubs what the clubs dues where going towards, they even sent certified letters as well and with no response they dropped there affiliation. Now these clubs wanted to be a part of SASS but with no response they voted to leave. I'm a newer shooter to sass (2 years) and I have a hard time believing sass can not stay open on 19,000 members who pay $65, but after the fee went up I know there are going to be lots of people who will not renew. Ive also noticed people calling others names and that's no way to attract new members, I think a lot of the questions being asked about where the $ goes are valid. Most local clubs survive on volunteers as well on what little $ they make, if sass is pulling in $1.2 million and not being able to survive I think members should know where that $ goes. Also I don't see a push in advertising to get new members or trying to attract younger members (25-35). IF founders ranch consumes the most $(I have no proof) then maybe its time to let it go to save the whole organization. just my $.02. I love sass and will continue to be a member.

I'm not calling it a gold mine, I think the opposite. But that is what is claimed in the first paragraph after they list the five things about FR. http://sassnet.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=241228

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3 out of 4 clubs in my area have dropped there sass affiliation since sass would not explain to the clubs what the clubs dues where going towards, they even sent certified letters as well and with no response they dropped there affiliation. Now these clubs wanted to be a part of SASS but with no response they voted to leave. I'm a newer shooter to sass (2 years) and I have a hard time believing sass can not stay open on 19,000 members who pay $65, but after the fee went up I know there are going to be lots of people who will not renew. Ive also noticed people calling others names and that's no way to attract new members, I think a lot of the questions being asked about where the $ goes are valid. Most local clubs survive on volunteers as well on what little $ they make, if sass is pulling in $1.2 million and not being able to survive I think members should know where that $ goes. Also I don't see a push in advertising to get new members or trying to attract younger members (25-35). IF founders ranch consumes the most $(I have no proof) then maybe its time to let it go to save the whole organization. just my $.02. I love sass and will continue to be a member.

My club had let our affiliation lapse due to an oversight. When we discovered the oversight, I promptly sent in the renewal and the $50. To our VERY small club the SASS affiliation is very important. Being listed on the SASS website is a big deal if you want to be found by prospective shooters. The SASS website isn't cheap to operate so I figure some club money going that way is good. We will use some of the resources provided by SASS for local advertising.

SASS also payed for an exhibitor booth at the Great American Outdoor Show this week in Pennsylvania. There will be 200,000 people attending that show from a 5-6 state area. The many clubs in the area are getting HUGE publicity.

This is all important enough to me that I will make a point of finding affiliated clubs to attend this coming season while most likely overlooking non-affiliated clubs.

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On 6/30/2016 at 8:00 AM, Yul Lose said:

Count me in. After what I saw last week, I see no reason not to.

Me too. A SASS gold badge kind of completes the deal. :)

I've never seen anything at a SASS sanctioned function that was not 100% something I don't want to be a part of. For life. 

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I have been a SASS member since 1998 23970 we went many years without a membership increase, had I joined way back I could have had a life very reasonable, I must admit I was a bit put back by the increase to $65.00 and with the magazine gone too ( a lot of old timers- like my Dad who's a life member don't even use a PC so even with the publication back quarterly is a plus, I went the entire year without receiving mine, when I pointed it out I was sent the back issues now again I am not receiving it?

As many pointed out; I cannot count the endless friends life long I have made cowboy shooting SASS has credit for that no question. what really turned me off over the last 6-8 years or so is the speed shooters who insisted the targets be 36" inches from the end of a handgun? god that's pathetic! all while trying to mask it as close targets so average shooters can hit the target and have more fun.... bogus they have fun anyway I'm not a top shooter but in my hay day did good, don't need a target I can reach out and dam near hit with my gun yuk!!

As I shoot state matches which require SASS membership therefore I re-upped again, Clearly the membership has dwindled we need to get more younger folks involved. not sure how to do that one recommendation I had to the office was to pull data from the past membership for shooters who had been members for 3 years and actually offer a discount to re-join and honor it for two years as an incentive to bring back folks whom left for whatever, raising costs has a negative response regardless of how much one personal feels it important Its called marketing lots of members leave for various reasons the goal is to get them to stay or come back that is not gonna happen at $65.00 annual don't matter what other clubs charge their is only one SASS.    

 

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On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2016 at 1:02 PM, Marauder SASS #13056 said:

 

Actually, back in the 1980's the lowest weight lead bullet i could find for 38's was 138 grain by one company in Ohio. Essentially all lead bullets were either 148 wad-cutter or 158 grain or a little larger.

 

There were beginning to be lighter self defense bullets as promoted by Hi-val in Indiana, but they were pioneers.

 

I think it was in the late or mid-1990's before 125 grain lead bullets were common - and those were initially from 9 mm molds.

 

So, Thanks, SASS for the great fun I've had!

That is just not true ! A friend of mine had a Ammunition company called Western ammunition service and in 1976 he was selling a 125 gr 357 mag JHP ammo. the bullet was  made by Winchester.

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Yes, Von, 125 JHP bullets were available, but did you notice I was not talking about that.  I was talking about Lead bullets.

 

Maybe someone some where made 125 grain Lead bullets, but I sure could not find them.  As I mentioned, I had to order the 138 grain bullets from about 1000 miles away because that was the only source I could find then.

 

And JHP's were not allowed since before I started SASS.

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2 hours ago, Marauder SASS #13056 said:

Yes, Von, 125 JHP bullets were available, but did you notice I was not talking about that.  I was talking about Lead bullets.

 

Maybe someone some where made 125 grain Lead bullets, but I sure could not find them.  As I mentioned, I had to order the 138 grain bullets from about 1000 miles away because that was the only source I could find then.

 

And JHP's were not allowed since before I started SASS.

Sorry Marauder I did not see the lead part, went back and read your post and it slipped by me. V.D.

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That's okay, Von.

 

Someone has to keep me honest :D:D:D

 

Edited by Marauder SASS #13056

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I love SASS & will always support them. I knew all the original Wild Bunch on a first name basis & they all knew me.

 

I have been away from CAS for quite a while, as I was fairly young when I joined (23). I took time off to get married & raise a family. Life & other priorities took precedence. Now that my children are almost out on their own I want to get involved again, but like the legendary titans that were displaced by Zeus & his newer gods, I feel out of place. From what I am seeing this is not the CAS I remember.

 

 I have seen recent videos of shooters shooting at machine gun speed at close targets, countless talk of short-strokes, Codymatics 3rd, 4th, 5th generations (?), & other modifications that were not allowed when SASS started. I feel so intimidated that I am not sure I would enjoy shooting at anything higher than a local match because of the emphasis that appears to be on speed & close targets.

 

Now, I am not saying there is anything wrong with speed; I am merely stating my 2 cents, & maybe other past SASS members feel the same way. Maybe that is the reason why they have strayed from the herd?

 

The very first stage I ever shot, before we could even engage a target we had to knock over the dynamite (wood prop) with a bull whip. It was hilarious to watch as some were decent & some took forever. I had been practicing with a bullwhip at the time & was fairly accurate, so I was actually able to grab the TNT & yank it back- I then proceeded to miss all five targets because of the adrenaline rush! The thing about it though... IT WAS FUN!!! I was hooked after that. Having to ride a stick pony to a designated spot? Silly, but FUN! The guns were unmodified, except for action jobs, & only a few shooters had any semblance of real speed. With no disrespect to any of these skilled shooters nowadays, back then it was commonly preached & understood that when SASS became a speed race with modified guns, that would be the day it began its decline. The motto was, "if it didn't exist in the old west or if you wouldn't see John Wayne using it, it was not allowed."

 

i have always been more interested in the costuming & comraderie, so I will enjoy myself no matter what, but as far as shooting I currently feel like maybe it's not for me anymore? I am not competitive-driven in this sport but after being away for so long I have no wish to look the fool, either. I joined many moons ago because it was fun, not because I had to be fast. Maybe SASS should think about breaking out these amazingly fast shooters & putting them in an entirely new class... I don't know. I am only saying that intimidation may keep a lot of people away from participating.

 

Want to get the numbers back up? Make the stages fun again & not just a speed race. I personally cannot see how rattling off 20 rounds in less than 2 seconds (exaggeration?) can be considered cowboy shooting. Impressive? Hell yes, but cowboy? Not in my book. Thank you for your time.

 

 

Edited by Jonah Hex SASS Life #127
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